What if I think that the community's description is not written in natural English but is written in some language of "copy-pasted-from-the-dictionary" kind? (Let me mention: I'm a non-native speaker.)
For example, how do you find the sentence "It's not allowed for you to use Japanese here. "?
I'd rather spell it like "You are not allowed to communicate in English in this community." or "Use of Japanese language is disallowed in this community." instead.
I'm assuming that the administrator of this group is a non-native speaker and supposing this is true, I'd like to make some comments on this.
1.) Your strong will for running this kind of group should highly be valued with no doubt, I admit...but...
2.) English language is not the property of non-native speakers just as Japanese language is not maintained in the U.S by non-native Caucasians.
So my point is, we should probably let a native-speaker run this group as a leader, maybe with some bilinguals who could bridge the native-speakers and non-native beginners.
Any thoughts and opinions?
For example, how do you find the sentence "It's not allowed for you to use Japanese here. "?
I'd rather spell it like "You are not allowed to communicate in English in this community." or "Use of Japanese language is disallowed in this community." instead.
I'm assuming that the administrator of this group is a non-native speaker and supposing this is true, I'd like to make some comments on this.
1.) Your strong will for running this kind of group should highly be valued with no doubt, I admit...but...
2.) English language is not the property of non-native speakers just as Japanese language is not maintained in the U.S by non-native Caucasians.
So my point is, we should probably let a native-speaker run this group as a leader, maybe with some bilinguals who could bridge the native-speakers and non-native beginners.
Any thoughts and opinions?
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コメント(72)
To:はっしーたっひー
ﾞIt's not allowed for you to use Japanese hereﾞ
is not mistaken English.
Sure, there may be a few different ways of saying the same thing, but there is no mistakes in that sentance.
Btw, I'm a Japanese citizen, born and grew up in the states, and am now a English teacher, so if you insist that it is a mistake, maybe we could do a debate or something, because I am sure that it isn't incorrect English.
ﾞIt's not allowed for you to use Japanese hereﾞ
is not mistaken English.
Sure, there may be a few different ways of saying the same thing, but there is no mistakes in that sentance.
Btw, I'm a Japanese citizen, born and grew up in the states, and am now a English teacher, so if you insist that it is a mistake, maybe we could do a debate or something, because I am sure that it isn't incorrect English.
At the beginning, I am very sorry for my poor English.
What I'm thinking is, the essentially important thing is not English language itself but what you are saying and doing by using English language in the real world. Now I am working in a foreign company and finding two kind of persons. The first one is, the persons who have the perfect skill of English. I guess they have ten years or more experience of living in English speaking country. I really envy them. But that's all they can do. They don't have any skills and opinions of managing and proceeding the project and no knowledge of the technology. And the second one is, the persons who have only so-so skill of English language. They can say at least they wanna to say in English, but far from perfect English. But they have strong skills and opinions of proceeding and managing the project, and perfect technical knowledge. Which is better? The native-English speakers do just only chatting with the first one. But they do the serious conversation about the business with the second one and they really believe them.
The main topic in this sled. The 管理人さん(organizer) of this community should be replaced with Native English speaker? I guess No. The sentences of this community's front page might have some mistakes and unusual expressions, but we can understand at leaset what 管理人さん wanna say. And above all, 管理人さん is doing 管理人さん's job well. The sled of "yamanote halloween 2008" was removed in a few days, do you know? This sled was a little offensive (including me, hehehe, I'm regretting a little...) so the sled should have been removed. And 管理人さん did it. Perfect job as 管理人さん, no? Jimmie-san should not be replaced. This community is running well with this 管理人さん.
What I'm thinking is, the essentially important thing is not English language itself but what you are saying and doing by using English language in the real world. Now I am working in a foreign company and finding two kind of persons. The first one is, the persons who have the perfect skill of English. I guess they have ten years or more experience of living in English speaking country. I really envy them. But that's all they can do. They don't have any skills and opinions of managing and proceeding the project and no knowledge of the technology. And the second one is, the persons who have only so-so skill of English language. They can say at least they wanna to say in English, but far from perfect English. But they have strong skills and opinions of proceeding and managing the project, and perfect technical knowledge. Which is better? The native-English speakers do just only chatting with the first one. But they do the serious conversation about the business with the second one and they really believe them.
The main topic in this sled. The 管理人さん(organizer) of this community should be replaced with Native English speaker? I guess No. The sentences of this community's front page might have some mistakes and unusual expressions, but we can understand at leaset what 管理人さん wanna say. And above all, 管理人さん is doing 管理人さん's job well. The sled of "yamanote halloween 2008" was removed in a few days, do you know? This sled was a little offensive (including me, hehehe, I'm regretting a little...) so the sled should have been removed. And 管理人さん did it. Perfect job as 管理人さん, no? Jimmie-san should not be replaced. This community is running well with this 管理人さん.
stacie>
my hero<3 your words are very harsh but its utterly gotten my heart :P thank u so much for encouraging me to re-deliberate my english skill hehe.
34>
im sorry for not being able to read ur name first cuz of my telus phone. but i totally agree with u. i see so many ppl with perfect english who 'cant' even do their assignments or whatever they should do in school.
i also prefer those ppl with great attitude n sense of humour than those incredibly nitpicking nominalists. lol
my hero<3 your words are very harsh but its utterly gotten my heart :P thank u so much for encouraging me to re-deliberate my english skill hehe.
34>
im sorry for not being able to read ur name first cuz of my telus phone. but i totally agree with u. i see so many ppl with perfect english who 'cant' even do their assignments or whatever they should do in school.
i also prefer those ppl with great attitude n sense of humour than those incredibly nitpicking nominalists. lol
Courage is very needed to make remarks here for me. Because I am still a beginner in English.However,everytime participants hear my story warmly.
I must study English and make an effort like you,はっしーたっひー. There are a lot of ppl who can speak English well, It becomes good study for me only even to read it.
So Please let me participate in this community.
And thanks again for everyone to hearing my poor English and nice to me.
I must study English and make an effort like you,はっしーたっひー. There are a lot of ppl who can speak English well, It becomes good study for me only even to read it.
So Please let me participate in this community.
And thanks again for everyone to hearing my poor English and nice to me.
はっしーたっひー
> Any thoughts and opinions?
I think you're misunderstanding the purpose of a community administrator. The admin doesn't correct people's English, or enforce the correctness of the English in this community. To be honest I can't recall the last time he posted.
But he does enforce the rules and keep the community free of spam/abuse. You don't need to be a native speaker to do that.
> Any thoughts and opinions?
I think you're misunderstanding the purpose of a community administrator. The admin doesn't correct people's English, or enforce the correctness of the English in this community. To be honest I can't recall the last time he posted.
But he does enforce the rules and keep the community free of spam/abuse. You don't need to be a native speaker to do that.
I'd feel offended when my Japanese is corrected by a non-native speaker (which used to happen all the time between me and my ex-gf who was an Irish-American, which btw was such a pain in my a** all the time), and even worse when this person acts like s/he rules the language.
It's the exact same thing I was trying to say, that is, if the subject being dealt with in/by this community is English (which is something we, the non-natives, don't ever get to rule because my English is not even half as good as that of native speakers), why not let the native speakers rule it?
I seriously don't understand why a native speaker like Stacy should even feel that I've said stuff like "Hey, I speak English better than some natives do!"......or did I actually?
It's the exact same thing I was trying to say, that is, if the subject being dealt with in/by this community is English (which is something we, the non-natives, don't ever get to rule because my English is not even half as good as that of native speakers), why not let the native speakers rule it?
I seriously don't understand why a native speaker like Stacy should even feel that I've said stuff like "Hey, I speak English better than some natives do!"......or did I actually?
wow... Look at you guys, you are now debating in English, no matter how many mistakes or whatsoever.....
hehehe.... I am so glad to read so many opinions here even though your english might not be so perfect or if you think your english is "perfect"...
I, myself make mistakes even in my native tongues (japanese and chinese and malay)... as many of you guys have mentioned, mistakes are meant for learning!
Good Luck!
hehehe.... I am so glad to read so many opinions here even though your english might not be so perfect or if you think your english is "perfect"...
I, myself make mistakes even in my native tongues (japanese and chinese and malay)... as many of you guys have mentioned, mistakes are meant for learning!
Good Luck!
The "managing ability" of an administrator I guess is far more important than how good s/he is at the subject handled by the community. I could easily bare to accept that since being forced to give up the admin's position must be such a harsh thing for Jimmy. (***To highlight, I did not say "Jimmy should be fired" though I DID mean to say it would be better for the group to have some admins who are native speakers and fluent non-native speakers. The whole purpose of suggesting this, if I may add, is so that the community would then gain some flexibility from which native speakers, non-native speakers and even the beginners would benefit.***)
Though, if admin's (and admin team's) lack of skills in their English is (are) to degrade the point and quality of the community, I suppose that is called "本末転倒".
You see how supreme court, government and the parliament house are positioned to ensure the quality and neutrality of policy-making as a whole? And that this system provides some flexibility to the citizens?
What I thought would be nice to have for this group, was a casual form of democracy. Nothing more or less than that.
Though, if admin's (and admin team's) lack of skills in their English is (are) to degrade the point and quality of the community, I suppose that is called "本末転倒".
You see how supreme court, government and the parliament house are positioned to ensure the quality and neutrality of policy-making as a whole? And that this system provides some flexibility to the citizens?
What I thought would be nice to have for this group, was a casual form of democracy. Nothing more or less than that.
Doesnt matter who the admin is or his/her native tongue.
The community isn't called "Only Perfect English"!
@
whoever doesnt like being corrected by non native speakers, can I give you some friendly advice, which is to accept all the help you can get. I dont turn my nose up at correction wether it comes from a swedish guy, a japanese adult or a japanese child.
Pride can get in the way of learning if you let it..
The community isn't called "Only Perfect English"!
@
whoever doesnt like being corrected by non native speakers, can I give you some friendly advice, which is to accept all the help you can get. I dont turn my nose up at correction wether it comes from a swedish guy, a japanese adult or a japanese child.
Pride can get in the way of learning if you let it..
The administrator probably doesn't have the right to correct
everyone's English here, nor does anyone else here, i believe.
However, seeing such disrespect given to a person who has decided to
bring English-speakers together, i can hardly leave this alone.
One gigantic obstacle in English-learning among the Japanese people
is the lack of courage to speak in English. The administrator, having
created this "English-only" place, has in fact accomplished a task
greater than anyone else had, in my opinion.
Everyone makes mistakes, and henceforth learns from mistakes.
When a person who tried to correct another person's mistake the
wrong way, another person would just go ahead and correct the first
person's mistake too.
Everyone has something to gain. And I respect the Administrator who
created this community so that everyone can speak English here, for
both native and non-native speakers.
I don't understand how someone who's so skeptical about "perfect English"
can be so upset about the actions of learners of the "esteemed"
English Language itself.
We should respect these people. Like how Japanese people respect
us Japanese learners.
(I apologize if I've written unnecessary things.
I just felt slightly offended by the TC
)
everyone's English here, nor does anyone else here, i believe.
However, seeing such disrespect given to a person who has decided to
bring English-speakers together, i can hardly leave this alone.
One gigantic obstacle in English-learning among the Japanese people
is the lack of courage to speak in English. The administrator, having
created this "English-only" place, has in fact accomplished a task
greater than anyone else had, in my opinion.
Everyone makes mistakes, and henceforth learns from mistakes.
When a person who tried to correct another person's mistake the
wrong way, another person would just go ahead and correct the first
person's mistake too.
Everyone has something to gain. And I respect the Administrator who
created this community so that everyone can speak English here, for
both native and non-native speakers.
I don't understand how someone who's so skeptical about "perfect English"
can be so upset about the actions of learners of the "esteemed"
English Language itself.
We should respect these people. Like how Japanese people respect
us Japanese learners.
(I apologize if I've written unnecessary things.
I just felt slightly offended by the TC
)
はっしーたっひー
> I'd feel offended when my Japanese is corrected by a non-native speaker
You don't need to feel offended because it's natural. Non-native speakers study the language logically from zero, but native speakers, especially Japanese, study the language just only for examinations in the school. As for me, I forgot everything after finishing the entrance exam of university. So it's natural that high-level non-native speakers know about its language so much better than native speakers.
One day a friend asked me "what is the meaning of ISSO? (isso ** shita houga yoi)"
Ya, I know this word well. I know when and how to use it. But I couldn't explain the exact meaning of this word.
But, high-level non-native Japanese speaker can do it easily. They studied and memorized each word one by one.
Native speakers can use and speak thieir own language better than anyone, but non-native speakers knows thier language better than native speakers.
> I'd feel offended when my Japanese is corrected by a non-native speaker
You don't need to feel offended because it's natural. Non-native speakers study the language logically from zero, but native speakers, especially Japanese, study the language just only for examinations in the school. As for me, I forgot everything after finishing the entrance exam of university. So it's natural that high-level non-native speakers know about its language so much better than native speakers.
One day a friend asked me "what is the meaning of ISSO? (isso ** shita houga yoi)"
Ya, I know this word well. I know when and how to use it. But I couldn't explain the exact meaning of this word.
But, high-level non-native Japanese speaker can do it easily. They studied and memorized each word one by one.
Native speakers can use and speak thieir own language better than anyone, but non-native speakers knows thier language better than native speakers.
> 36 KEiTA san
Hello. Nice to meet you. I am YASUTAKE from Tokyo, classified to the "3rd" group in my 34's example, which is the group of the persons without language skill, skill and opinion of managing and proceeding the project, and knowledge of the technology. Nothing
I don't think of the language as "skill". It's just the "method" to tell the things to another person. I want everyone not to concentrate their power only for the "method"...
But translating is so much different. They need to understand the both language logically and correctly. They have great "skill".
Hello. Nice to meet you. I am YASUTAKE from Tokyo, classified to the "3rd" group in my 34's example, which is the group of the persons without language skill, skill and opinion of managing and proceeding the project, and knowledge of the technology. Nothing
I don't think of the language as "skill". It's just the "method" to tell the things to another person. I want everyone not to concentrate their power only for the "method"...
But translating is so much different. They need to understand the both language logically and correctly. They have great "skill".
>Kellerzwerg
(This is a very personal opinion I'm about to post and I'd like you to read it with some awareness of it.)
English, precisely, is the language which I consider used to be, and only used to be in England before the British succeeded taking over the world as of today. To support this idea, you could refer to the following; (Quoted from Dictionary.com)
a.) the people of England collectively, esp. as distinguished from the Scots, Welsh, and Irish.
b.) the Germanic language of the British Isles, widespread and standard also in the U.S. and most of the British Commonwealth, historically termed Old English (c450–c1150), Middle English (c1150–c1475), and Modern English (after c1475). Abbreviation: E
Now, imagine for instance, centuries later by which time Japan has somehow taken over the world and "the global language" is Japanese with millions of variations across the world......
Within these variations, the populations - of countries other than Japan, where the primary language is Japanese - would share a very common way of saying most things. Let this be called "the core" of the globalized language.
If, then someone is too far from "the core" with saying most things in Japanese and this person repeatedly insists that his is a fluent Japanese speaker, would you still consider the person's language as Japanese?
If I faced a person like that, I would literary slap that person and tell him to "shut up and go back to school where they teach THE JAPANESE LANGUAGE (hence "the core")".......I would scream at him inside "Who are you to act like you rule the language?"
Now back to the thesis and then to the conclusion, I think the definition of "speaking good English" in today's world is "speaking the core of English fluently", where the term "the core" stands for a set of standard expressions commonly used in the U.K, U.S, Canada, Australia, and other territories which formerly used to be governed by the U.K.
Arrrrrrrg! This is becoming like a school paper (if I added more "academic-ness" and ridiculous length to it).....
(This is a very personal opinion I'm about to post and I'd like you to read it with some awareness of it.)
English, precisely, is the language which I consider used to be, and only used to be in England before the British succeeded taking over the world as of today. To support this idea, you could refer to the following; (Quoted from Dictionary.com)
a.) the people of England collectively, esp. as distinguished from the Scots, Welsh, and Irish.
b.) the Germanic language of the British Isles, widespread and standard also in the U.S. and most of the British Commonwealth, historically termed Old English (c450–c1150), Middle English (c1150–c1475), and Modern English (after c1475). Abbreviation: E
Now, imagine for instance, centuries later by which time Japan has somehow taken over the world and "the global language" is Japanese with millions of variations across the world......
Within these variations, the populations - of countries other than Japan, where the primary language is Japanese - would share a very common way of saying most things. Let this be called "the core" of the globalized language.
If, then someone is too far from "the core" with saying most things in Japanese and this person repeatedly insists that his is a fluent Japanese speaker, would you still consider the person's language as Japanese?
If I faced a person like that, I would literary slap that person and tell him to "shut up and go back to school where they teach THE JAPANESE LANGUAGE (hence "the core")".......I would scream at him inside "Who are you to act like you rule the language?"
Now back to the thesis and then to the conclusion, I think the definition of "speaking good English" in today's world is "speaking the core of English fluently", where the term "the core" stands for a set of standard expressions commonly used in the U.K, U.S, Canada, Australia, and other territories which formerly used to be governed by the U.K.
Arrrrrrrg! This is becoming like a school paper (if I added more "academic-ness" and ridiculous length to it).....
I'd much rather people use ungrammatical, misspelled English than not use it at all. I know that I'm reticent to use Japanese because of my embarrassment at how terrible it is; I don't want keep people from speaking here because they worry they're not perfect.
(I'm more than happy to help people correct their grammar, spelling, or word choices - but I don't feel compelled to impose it on people.)
(I'm more than happy to help people correct their grammar, spelling, or word choices - but I don't feel compelled to impose it on people.)
> はっしーたっひーさん
It's interesting point. But you don't need to consider about the centries later. Just consider about the elder persons in Aomori. As you know their language is so much different from the language of Tokyo and NHK and textbook with strong accent.
Then one question.
Whether they are speaking Japanese or not?
Are they Japanese citizens who are not speaking Japanese?
And one more.
India is also former English colony...
It's interesting point. But you don't need to consider about the centries later. Just consider about the elder persons in Aomori. As you know their language is so much different from the language of Tokyo and NHK and textbook with strong accent.
Then one question.
Whether they are speaking Japanese or not?
Are they Japanese citizens who are not speaking Japanese?
And one more.
India is also former English colony...
I often compare Japan with the U.K, in which case Japanese in Japan is English language in the U.K.
Now, anyone remember the geography class? And that they taught you there are also countries like Ireland, Scotland, and Wales where people don't speak English as their primary language?
Like we have アイヌ語 in Hokkaido in contrast to 日本語, I think the regional variations like 青森弁 (=ones with distinctive accent) could be handled just the way Irish language, Scottish language and Walsh language are in the U.K.
If I may apply this theory, 青森弁 may not exactly be a part of Japanese language but may well be classified as a language which belongs to the same language group as the one Japanese language does.
Speaking of India, I think the situation is a bit different, and by this statement, I mean the following;
1.) In India, those with access to education of English language still remain to be rather wealthy ones, hence making the number of English speakers quite limited.
2.) Unlike U.S, Canada, and Australia, the majority of India's population is taken up by the aborigines of that region, not by Europe-origin people.
Now, anyone remember the geography class? And that they taught you there are also countries like Ireland, Scotland, and Wales where people don't speak English as their primary language?
Like we have アイヌ語 in Hokkaido in contrast to 日本語, I think the regional variations like 青森弁 (=ones with distinctive accent) could be handled just the way Irish language, Scottish language and Walsh language are in the U.K.
If I may apply this theory, 青森弁 may not exactly be a part of Japanese language but may well be classified as a language which belongs to the same language group as the one Japanese language does.
Speaking of India, I think the situation is a bit different, and by this statement, I mean the following;
1.) In India, those with access to education of English language still remain to be rather wealthy ones, hence making the number of English speakers quite limited.
2.) Unlike U.S, Canada, and Australia, the majority of India's population is taken up by the aborigines of that region, not by Europe-origin people.
I don't wanna offend anyone any more unintentionally, and don't want the opposite either. so I guess I'd just leave the community for good. Sorry for creating such a mess, and thanks for those who paid a little attention to this thread.
I'd rather you delete the topic, but you are also free if you wish to continue.
I'd rather you delete the topic, but you are also free if you wish to continue.
I can understand what you're expressing, but this is mixi...a Japanese blogging site. Although there are native English speakers here, the majority are Japanese. This site was probably also created ENTIRELY for Japanese (not suprising taking into consideration the desire for uniformity). Anyways, it is only natural that Jimmy wanted to create an English only community, and even MORE natural if non-native Caucasians (which this word offended me seeing as Caucasian has nothing to do with anything, what about blacks, hispanics, etc.) made a Japanese community.
From an Anthropological perspective, language exists for mere function of communication. That means even if mistakes are made and the point is understood, then language has done it's job. There are many people in this world who aspire to be perfect, but very little who do succeed. This does not make them terrible, stupid, but merely an "average" human being.
Maybe you want to be better than average, My husband is the same way, but as I even say to him, you may be technically correct, but you just look like a (place choice word here).
Also, you might want to think about how to talk to people in a diplomatic fashion. I'm sure you could have said what you wanted in a lighter manner. Sometimes people will just get offended, but hey....at least you can say you tried, right???
Finally,
I don't necessarily think you were trying to be an ass or anything. I just think you strongly believe in never accepting anything less than perfect, but have you taken a look at the average human lately?? (`specially all those obese or just stupid people) They do not care about perfection, so your efforts are useless.
From an Anthropological perspective, language exists for mere function of communication. That means even if mistakes are made and the point is understood, then language has done it's job. There are many people in this world who aspire to be perfect, but very little who do succeed. This does not make them terrible, stupid, but merely an "average" human being.
Maybe you want to be better than average, My husband is the same way, but as I even say to him, you may be technically correct, but you just look like a (place choice word here).
Also, you might want to think about how to talk to people in a diplomatic fashion. I'm sure you could have said what you wanted in a lighter manner. Sometimes people will just get offended, but hey....at least you can say you tried, right???
Finally,
I don't necessarily think you were trying to be an ass or anything. I just think you strongly believe in never accepting anything less than perfect, but have you taken a look at the average human lately?? (`specially all those obese or just stupid people) They do not care about perfection, so your efforts are useless.
I could delete this thread for being the creator like some mentioned, however, considering the amount of response (both positive or negative) people have submitted and time they have spent typing them up, I could not simply decide to throw everyone's literature (with thousands of words in it) into the dustbin just in one-click. Plus, I believe this might be a resource which could be interesting to look at some years later when (supposingly) the members of this community consist of different population of different backgrounds and generations.
Having created such a negative impact and mess, I'm sorry but I don't think I'd stay here any longer in any ways, with hundreds of people leaving their footprints on my "あしあと" every time I write something......cuz it makes me feel like I'm being surrounded by so many snipers.....
Will stay in this community till 24.00 today, so I'd like to see if people want to preserve this thread or want me to discard it. If "discarding" outnumbers "preserving", then I'll delete this thread as suggested.
I'm very, I mean super sorry for having done this, and am wishing the best for all of you because the attitude of trying to use English (which indirectly shows the attitude towards uniting the world) could one day change Japan and the world for the better. Please do keep up with your English, no matter how (in)confident of it you may be.
Should anyone wish to keep in touch with me (which I doubt anyone would because I have shown my strong and hard-to-coop-with personality), you are welcome to send me a request for my-miku, but please do not do so if you intend to spam me around.
Thanks all again, and bye-bye!
Having created such a negative impact and mess, I'm sorry but I don't think I'd stay here any longer in any ways, with hundreds of people leaving their footprints on my "あしあと" every time I write something......cuz it makes me feel like I'm being surrounded by so many snipers.....
Will stay in this community till 24.00 today, so I'd like to see if people want to preserve this thread or want me to discard it. If "discarding" outnumbers "preserving", then I'll delete this thread as suggested.
I'm very, I mean super sorry for having done this, and am wishing the best for all of you because the attitude of trying to use English (which indirectly shows the attitude towards uniting the world) could one day change Japan and the world for the better. Please do keep up with your English, no matter how (in)confident of it you may be.
Should anyone wish to keep in touch with me (which I doubt anyone would because I have shown my strong and hard-to-coop-with personality), you are welcome to send me a request for my-miku, but please do not do so if you intend to spam me around.
Thanks all again, and bye-bye!
I do hate internet translaters. A native speaker can always tell when it has been used.
Allthough, I do not see any problem with the description of this community. I also dont see a problem with a non native speaker being the leader either. Im pretty sure he is a native actually. But it wouldnt matter if he wasnt either because everybody is free to start topics and post
Allthough, I do not see any problem with the description of this community. I also dont see a problem with a non native speaker being the leader either. Im pretty sure he is a native actually. But it wouldnt matter if he wasnt either because everybody is free to start topics and post
Although this thread does indeed contain a lot of negative
emotions, i do believe it should serve as a good reference, in the
event if another person shares the same thoughts (in future).
I guess this community also gracefully accepts your apology, so don't
be bothered by it. You were just being honest.
(too honest, at times, though)
See ya around, dear sir.
emotions, i do believe it should serve as a good reference, in the
event if another person shares the same thoughts (in future).
I guess this community also gracefully accepts your apology, so don't
be bothered by it. You were just being honest.
(too honest, at times, though)
See ya around, dear sir.
too much for me to say and read! Lol
oh well... i dont really understand why some ppl want to jeorpadise their mother language for the other language. *sigh*
btw, do u really talk like that in japanese? or r u just being very very proud(possibly stuck-up?) of ur english after going through so many plateaus? being better at studying doesnt make you a better person.
Id probably keep this memoriable thread as a good debate, but if you ever wanna start it again, u better carriyoass to the north end for some prude meditation ;)
oh well... i dont really understand why some ppl want to jeorpadise their mother language for the other language. *sigh*
btw, do u really talk like that in japanese? or r u just being very very proud(possibly stuck-up?) of ur english after going through so many plateaus? being better at studying doesnt make you a better person.
Id probably keep this memoriable thread as a good debate, but if you ever wanna start it again, u better carriyoass to the north end for some prude meditation ;)
I still want to add, that in my experiences in office world one thing clearly came to show: There is no CORRECT english in practise.
You have to differ from Schools or Unis where you get points on a predefined work or subject and according to how close you meet the expectations of teachers or professors you will receive points.
In Joblife though, you have many people, many characters, many backgrounds and absolutely nothing is predefined. Everyone of those people can see most only his/her surrounding and acts accordingly. They send you a message like the way they would talk with their bosses or customers who most oftenly belong to same cultural circle.
So you get this message in english and most likely you not only have to translate the "language information" from english to your native language, but also the "emotional information" from your contact partners situation to your own.
And to put it straight, there are several high paid engineers or managers who are unable to do any of both conversions. Insecurity, fear, ignorance or merely arrogance can hamper that. Since that and for this very reason I have to pay high respect to anyone who is willing and daring to involve him/herself into international communication as we do here. Native speaker or not is totally irrelevant for that.
You have to differ from Schools or Unis where you get points on a predefined work or subject and according to how close you meet the expectations of teachers or professors you will receive points.
In Joblife though, you have many people, many characters, many backgrounds and absolutely nothing is predefined. Everyone of those people can see most only his/her surrounding and acts accordingly. They send you a message like the way they would talk with their bosses or customers who most oftenly belong to same cultural circle.
So you get this message in english and most likely you not only have to translate the "language information" from english to your native language, but also the "emotional information" from your contact partners situation to your own.
And to put it straight, there are several high paid engineers or managers who are unable to do any of both conversions. Insecurity, fear, ignorance or merely arrogance can hamper that. Since that and for this very reason I have to pay high respect to anyone who is willing and daring to involve him/herself into international communication as we do here. Native speaker or not is totally irrelevant for that.
The Trog says :" Ngh! head hurt bad! Need Club!"
which in a proper English would convey the deep distress to see someone failing to grasp the role of a administrator in a web 2.0 environment.
A solution for our hollowed rock resident would be to either go to Womb til the early lights or grab a strong piece of wood and smack a few fellow debaters.
Ah, communication is such an interesting thing.
which in a proper English would convey the deep distress to see someone failing to grasp the role of a administrator in a web 2.0 environment.
A solution for our hollowed rock resident would be to either go to Womb til the early lights or grab a strong piece of wood and smack a few fellow debaters.
Ah, communication is such an interesting thing.
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