☆ENGLISH ONLY☆コミュのUS Congress issues formal apology to black Americans for slavery

Like I said... they have motives no doubt. But it is still better than nothing.

What about the Navajo, and Deni Indians in Canada ( as well as the poor White Miners) that were allowed to work the Uranium mines in the 40`s ? All the while being contaminated by high doses of radiation. The US and Canadian governments knew about the dangers and just let it happen. Now those people that worked the mines are dying of cancer at an alarming rate. The US government finally admitted they were wrong. The Canadian government is still holding out to
this day. No compensations ..... no apology. Nothing.
This US congress apology (although late) ( and probably not sincere) is a vital first step. It`s up to the people now to make sure it`s better than nothing.

What I understand is that Slavery was a global institution that bolstered the economy of the Western world.
I believe that any sort of apology or any form of reparations should come not merely from the United States,
but from all the beneficiaries of the global slave trade,
to the end of leveling the economic playing field throughout the globe.

Very good point :)

"God's last name ain't damn
and my uncle ain't Sam."

the apology will be the only step. and apology to who? all the former slaves have passed away? of course i have ancestors who were slaves but that part of the family tree is lost. i don't know who they were.　i don't know where my ancestors came from in afrika.

Apology when there is no one left to sue the government. great idea. it's worst than nothing.

So Canada will do the same.

#23:

Yeah, apparently the "whether or not to apologize for slavery" issue has been fairly big in Britain over the last few years as well, though I don't know any details.

Awesome.

If you read the linked article, it states that the sponsor is a white man from a majority black district running against a black challenger in the upcoming election. How fortuitous.

Also ironic that the sponsor tried to join the congressional black caucus only to be told its against the rules. Tasty tasty black on white racism. Gets me hot.

#27 Yeah... that`s why I said it stunk of political motives.

#25 F.I.P I am in the same boat as you and understand what you mean but I am trying not to be cynical. I see the bullshit, but I am trying to believe that there can be some good in this after all.
Wishful thinking because the truth sucks. I don`t want to wish never ending conflict (like in the middle east) on any country.

If only something like this were also in the Senate... then I'd really be impressed that the HoR and the Senate passed it.

Too bad that most likely in a few months, the Senate will be losing its only Black member to the presidency...

I read it.

Japanease also forthfully brought Koreans to Japan and did brutal invations in China.
Whatever background was there, past failures are failures.We are not innocent and will be not innocent,I suppose.

In that view,Anerica stands the same ground as Japan dose.
I greatly give a praise to America's brave decision.

so do we get like a letter in the mail or something? lol

I've been looking in the mail every day for my O.J. prize!

What I can tell is that thhis first step about slavery will be
associated with the relationship between the afro-american and
african people.

Because their ancesters had the same roots and souls.

For your reference.

www.aaaprogram.org

correction

For your reference

www.objectives-reconciliation.org

-Luke.

The Congressional Black Caucus exists for the sole fact that there are so few blacks in the House of Representatives, and that they're vastly underrepresented. That would like be like having someone who is not Japanese join a group that pertains TO the Japanese. PoC deserve to have a safe haven where they can discuss issues that pertain to their community, and not have to always play teacher, or hear people like you shout "reverse-racism" every time you hear something that you don't like.

For the record - racism is a system. Racism involves a power dynamic, though thanks for trying that tired "reverse-racism" cry that so many people do with little success.

this is m.o. from the group FIP
(#25 was posted by DopeDaddy)


#30 Japanese will never apologize for the brutal massacres that occured in China. The government is too stubborn & pretends to believe it never took place. Im japanese､and as a Japanese citizen､ i do think Japan should apologize since some the victims who survived are still alive today.

However in THIS case､ its much too late for an apology. How are slave reparations going to help black people in america today?

>>まぁアレだ - Why should rappers have to complain about the past when your contemporaries today are doing such a phenomenal job of keeping institutionalized racism up?

Actually, IMO, most of society, both "victims", "oppressors", and especially the
ignorant keep the institutional "racism" cycle going. (Obviously not all but enough) rappers are just a
highly visible example. They are a major part of the media towards
the young generation, perpetuating the "it's ok to have a chip on
your shoulder towards EVERYONE because you're a victim" attitude.

Not saying oppression does not exist, actually it's alive and well,
but at this point in history the
only solution to fight it is for minorities to get more people into
prominent positions. Not waste tax payer time and money on the past.

I'm strictly speaking on solutions. Apologies and reparations produce
ZERO results for the future of any oppressed people - IMO.

Slavery set off a chain of events that have forever altered the lives of African Americans and their descendents. There is ample evidence that post Slavery the US did very little to help establish former slaves into the mainstream economy. In fact most carried on in roles they had previously as workin poor instead of slaves.

Discrimination and generations of economic hardship are still telling in African American communities. And stigma and prejudice are still very real everyday issues.

My stance is this. An apology is nice but what is really required are long term valid solutions for the remaining issues that have left African American communities behind. Thankfully these same measures would apply to helping other minority communities.

1. US should acknowledge economic gaps between minority and mainstream populations and work to address them. This includes the restoration of eductional benefits for minorities and an extension of this to families who cannot afford educations for their children regardless of race.

2. Roosevelt's economic stimulus during the depression was to put people to work building infrastructure. I think we should apply similar logic for both infrastructure and the rebuilding of poor cities and neighborhoods. This plan should include career and job training programs for all poor people and the creation of 100,000s of jobs to work on civic and infrastructure projects.

In the past this kind of rebuilding economic plan has worked to more than pay for itself in the resulting economic growth.

3. Descendents of slaves should be paid reparations. But these should not be in the form of personal pay outs. Rather they should be offered as opportunity vouchers. These would be exchangable for tuition as schools, universities and vocational institutions. They would be available as small business start up capitol. And the would be avaialable as medical and retirement support for the elderly.

This program would be limited peole born by the start date. And would be linked to return public service requirements for young people.

Then we can set slavery aside and move on to the future enabled by programs like these that benefit the families of historical slaves and other underclasses.

"Actually, IMO, most of society, both "victims", "oppressors", and especially the
ignorant keep the institutional "racism" cycle going. (Obviously not all but enough) rappers are just a
highly visible example. They are a major part of the media towards
the young generation, perpetuating the "it's ok to have a chip on
your shoulder towards EVERYONE because you're a victim" attitude. "

Ironically, Rappers are paid handsome amounts of money by white record executives to keep that going, and people that invest the most money in Rap are white teenagers. A whole entire grouping of intelligent rap exists, but you'll never see it because it's not what sells, and additionally, it's not what's going to be put forth on MTV or BET.

"Not saying oppression does not exist, actually it's alive and well,
but at this point in history the
only solution to fight it is for minorities to get more people into
prominent positions. Not waste tax payer time and money on the past."

Because, obviously, Institutional racism and inequities in incarceration, income and education are things of the past, right?

An Apology is a step in the right direction. Would you rather African-Americans didn't have one at all so that it would make you feel better?

Amber, but how do you get more minorities into prominent positions when as communities they lag far behind mainstream white communities? Minorities in America are more likely to be impoverished, imprisoned and suffer from abuse problems.

If you want racism to go away. And I mean go away as much as possible with human nature, you must first invest in creating a level playing field of both opportunities and economic viability. Without this critical step, only a modest percentage of the poor minorities will rise and cycles of poverty will continue.

But to be fair, poor whites suffer almost the same problems. So let's have programs that address poverty and opportunity universally. Raise the poor through opportunity, education, economic development and micro-finance plans. Improve the communities and level the playing field. Then you can see real progress. But never before you make these hard investments.

As for rappers. Again and again I see the argument of rappers raised when the race question is raised. So let me ask this. Does Marylin Manson represent white American society? Or Evanessence or any other band for that matter. Is Stephani an icon of white culture and society?

To expect pop culture to be representative of the greater ethnic population does not make sense. Rap is business for a consumer market with a demand that extends well beyond minority communities. Ask Japanese if they like R&B and rap. This is pop culture not real culture.

If you don't want heavy metal and twangy country bands representing white culture, then imagine how most African Americans feel about a hand full of pop stars being sited every time their community is mentioned.

To assume that rappers represent the black community is the same level of shallow assertion as the Mafia represents all Italian Americans. Or Sushi Chefs all Japanese Americans. Learn to separate what you see on TV and in the media from the reality of ethnic communities in America and elsewhere. Rappers do not represent the black community that I know.

It is an excuse to ignore the real topic. So please no more invocation of rappers.

41 Amber
> people that invest the most money in Rap are white teenagers.

This is why it's so mystifying that, on topics like this, someone always brings up rap lyrics. Do they seriously think that "bitches and hos" stuff is at the top of the charts because of 12% of the population?

So if I am made up of Native American and African heritage do I get two letters of apology ?

"Amber, but how do you get more minorities into prominent positions when as communities they lag far behind mainstream white communities? Minorities in America are more likely to be impoverished, imprisoned and suffer from abuse problems. "

Agreed. This is why you have to make sure that the schools are bettered, and that a program like Affirmative Action remains. Affirmative Action is a program that is often misunderstood by many people. It's not a program that puts unqualified minorities in decent positions. It's a program that opens the door for hard-working minorities to be able to even be considered for a job/school.

The Level playing field is necessary. America knows that it is, which is either why people are trying hard to make sure that it's more level, or that the government makes sure that they drag their feet with leveling that playing field.

Barack Obama brought up the statement that a reparations check is not that blacks need - and frankly, I agree with him entirely. Sure, it would make for one hell of an economic boost, but then what? Inequality will still continue. So, something that would work as a better form of recompense to descendants of slaves would be improved conditions of life. More jobs, better schools, and a reformed justice system. And not only would better schools work for Blacks, but it would also work very well for other poor races of people, like people in West Virginia.

I agree with your statement about the rappers 100% (and if anything I was arguing a point that someone else made.) Unfortunately, in America, black accomplishments outside of music and sport are not celebrated or even embraced. It's so much easier and "safer" for people to paint all blacks under the umbrella of collective irresponsibility that Mainstream rap perpetuates, without recognizing who is funding it.

Amber thanks for clarifying. I think we are on the same page with what solutions are needed.

The challenge has been how to achieve these objectives. I hope Obama will open the door to that opportunity.

I do firmly believe that an infrastructure project would be a great way to kick this off. Especially if priority is given to local companies to take point in executing projects. This would bring money into areas where it is badly needed.

The program could include:
1. Neighborhood renewal projects. New schools, public facilities, home renovation for elderly and poor residents. Provision of better local security and development of community programs.

2. Micro-economic programs similar to those in India to encourage local small business development. These have had an amazing impact where tried. Giving small loans to small business people along with advice and support. Creates jobs and local economies.

3. Local and state highway and transporation projects. Especially public transport solutions and bridge and road renewal. This is green friendly by adding more public rail services and reducing dependence on cars. If these projects are given out to local companies, the chances of having that money end up creating local jobs is much higher.

4. Education programs for all poor. Reeduction for adults to learn new skills. Higher education guarantees for more young people. Special programs for career changes to fund the education and creation of more teachers, health care professionals and civil service training for more community workers.

And I do believe in the use of a reparations program that would provide vouchers for education, small business initiatives, elder care, training and development and other valuable tools to create more opportunities for people in these communities.

These ideas would be a great way for the US government to prove that the apology was sincere and to put their money/actions where their mouth is. Now if none of this happens ? What are we going to do about it?

Revolution.

Or...

We start voting for people who really care about our communities and stop electing people who are just the political arm of the corporate world.

Too much of our political process is all about who has the biggest campaign budget. Well that means the guys with rich backers who expect him/her to represent their intrests.

One other area of reform should be election processes. All candidates should receive national funding for production of a policy book and a set number of TV spots. Same goes for visits. Level the field so that people who can really represent have a chance to win as equals to the wealthy.

That seems to make way too much sense to be applied in this world we live in.

>Kelly

Interesting what you suggest about campaign funding. Are there any limits on the money that can be spent in Election year in the States?

>> Would you rather African-Americans didn't have one at all so that it would make you feel better?

Have no problem with the apology, however, it serves no purpose.
Programs such as those mentioned above, serve a purpose.

>>Rappers are paid handsome amounts of money by white record executives to keep that going,

Doesn't change the fact that the messengers are often black. And
they are happy to send that message so long as they're getting
paid.

Doesn't change the fact that many black kids listen to it, and
self-victimize because of the lyrics. But I would also say that
generally kids of any color in any poor neighborhood self-victimize
and identify themselves with it. Obviously, it's not the only
thing that causes this, but it's a key factor. And, yes, IMO
self-victimizing regardless of your culture, does no good. It's
not unique to African-Americans.

>>you must first invest in creating a level playing field of both opportunities and economic viability.

Chicken or the egg.

Your idea is nice but it will never happen. The scale can be tipped
slightly for the better but the rest is up to the individuals. The more individuals that get to a more prominent position, the more the scale
will be tipped.

>>Unfortunately, in America, black accomplishments outside of music and sport are not celebrated or even embraced.

Yes, it is sad. But is this all the fault of non-black people? I don't
think so.

It is very unfortunate to see, when a young black from a poor
neighborhood is successful in the business world, he's not persecuted by whites. He's persecuted by his own people as being a sell out of some
sort. I've seen it on a personal level many times.

@38

I feel obliged correct this misconception. It's just propaganda ROK & PRC use when they want to guilt trip the Japanese.

Japanese government officials have on numerous occasions (more than 20) apologized, accepted responsibility, and expressed remorse for the suffering inflicted upon its neighbors during the war.

This is not disputable at all. Look it up.

@Amber/37

Your grinding axe is almost deafening.

So far, the only one to mention reverse racism in this topic is you. My tongue-in-cheek comment was intended to direct attention to the irony of a man who wanted to join a group ostensibly in order to better represent his constituency, but was denied membership because of his ethnicity. The best way to make progress on any socially important issue is by forming a coalition of people from all parts of society. It seems silly to deny someone access to a wealth of knowledge about the people he is tasked with representing because you don't want to "... have to always play teacher." How else is he going to learn about the community that elected him?

If there were a very positive group called " The White people of America" that donated to charity, helped the poor of any race, etc... Should I as a POC expect to be able to join? Asking to be a member would be dumb since I can read and understand the name of the group. I would not expect to be able to join that group and wouldn`t ask out of respect for them. I wouldn`t feel anything negative about that because I am not White. I would not feel like I belonged even if I was allowed to join. I am not racist but the fact is that I am what I am. You don`t enter a poodle into a Cat contest or visa versa. Why can`t we recognize and enjoy or differences without coming off racist?

TOG, whites can certainly join the NAACP, and other similar groups. And I think you know perfectly well that a white-only group like you mention would be vilified, regardless of how positive they were.

The issue with the caucus, presumably, is that it's a political group, and admitting whites would dilute its political power. If it was open to whites, then presumably most if not all congressmen would try to join (regardless of whether they were really concerned or just pandering for the black vote), and that would make the whole thing a joke.

"Doesn't change the fact that the messengers are often black. And they are happy to send that message so long as they're getting paid."

Thank you for ignoring what I said. Really, that's rich. And as I told you before, white record execs are the ones that are also paying these men insane amounts of money for this. It is extremely commonplace for the only black man to be in a music boardroom is the artist, and he's being told what to say. BET and MTV is owned by a white company (Viacom) - and they're in the business of selling stereotypes - and not just stereotypes of blacks, either.

You can so readily place blame on rappers and such but without even stopping to look at the deeper problem that exists. Either because it's inconvenient for you or you genuinely just don't know.

"Doesn't change the fact that many black kids listen to it, and self-victimize because of the lyrics. But I would also say that generally kids of any color in any poor neighborhood self-victimize and identify themselves with it. Obviously, it's not the only thing that causes this, but it's a key factor. And, yes, IMO self-victimizing regardless of your culture, does no good. It's not unique to African-Americans. "

Again - you ignored what I said. You ignored a lot of posts in this thread simply to make a point that "Why are those black kids self-victimizing?" Maybe, it's because black males have a 1 in 3 chance of going to prison, whereas someone white has a 1 in 16 chance of it. Maybe, because black children are much more likely to go to an underfunded school where they're being taught years behind everyone else. We are least likely to be taken seriously by our own merits because far too many other Americans are under the impression that "You're just that successful because you're a quota hire."

Self-victimizing? Again. Why does anyone have to self-victimize when your contemporaries are doing such a fine job of keeping up a racially stratified system, with no real intent to break those barriers?

"Your idea is nice but it will never happen. The scale can be tipped slightly for the better but the rest is up to the individuals. The more individuals that get to a more prominent position, the more the scale will be tipped. "

Nope. In a country where white supremacy is the order of the day, such a thing won't happen.

"Yes, it is sad. But is this all the fault of non-black people? I don't think so."

White supremacy is to blame for this. Unless this system of white supremacy is toppled so that we have a situation that is much more conducive to total equality occurs, then it will continue to be the fault of white supremacy.

"It is very unfortunate to see, when a young black from a poorneighborhood is successful in the business world, he's not persecuted by whites. He's persecuted by his own people as being a sell out of some sort. I've seen it on a personal level many times. ""

So even though you've seen it happen to some, you know enough about whole race of people to make that assumption? And what do you mean that he's not persecuted by whites? Absolutely hell yes he IS. You haven't the slightest idea of how many obstacles that person is going to face to even be considered as relevant or even be recognized. Yes, some people will say that he's a sellout. However, that amount of blacks is in the MINORITY.

"Your grinding axe is almost deafening.

So far, the only one to mention reverse racism in this topic is you. My tongue-in-cheek comment was intended to direct attention to the irony of a man who wanted to join a group ostensibly in order to better represent his constituency, but was denied membership because of his ethnicity. The best way to make progress on any socially important issue is by forming a coalition of people from all parts of society. It seems silly to deny someone access to a wealth of knowledge about the people he is tasked with representing because you don't want to "... have to always play teacher." How else is he going to learn about the community that elected him?"

Yes. I have a big ass axe to grind. But when you're not seen as being an equal because you're black and you're a woman, you'd likely have one too. When you speak about racism from a point-of-view that is less than happy, then you'll have a massive axe to grind.

Tongue in cheek? This would also be something else that I hear a lot from people AFTER they get called out. Are you sure that it was tongue-in-cheek and didn't have a ring of real resentment when you said it? The remainder of your statement is telling me otherwise.

Yes. There can be a group for those who want to change society. As Fen said, white people can join the NAACP. The issue with saying that "He's being rejected because of his RACE (not ethnicity)" is that the Congressional Black Caucus is undeniably a group for black congresspeople. It serves as many other groups that are started by and are meant for PoC - it's supposed to be a safe haven for them in a society where a safe haven does not really exist for PoC - a safe haven where they can talk about issues of racism and such where they don't have to be called "oversensitive" or "reverse-racism" or any of that crap.

How can you better represent your constituency? By giving a damn about them. By listening to their issues. You don't always have to be part of a group to make a difference. I know that for him, it would be nice if he could be a part of the CBC, but he isn't, because he isn't black. If you want to learn more about black society, there is a wealth of research over the internet and books and such. There are classes in universities that teach these things - there is even an entire major/minor dedicated to it -- called African American Studies. There are sociology classes about this. It is possible for someone to learn about all these things by making the effort instead of joining a group and expecting to have ones hand held.

#54 "And I think you know perfectly well that a white-only group like you mention would be vilified, regardless of how positive they were. " I don`t know any such thing and would not have a problem with a positive action group like that. Now if they were preaching hate, etc... that would be a different story altogether. There is a time and place for everything. And I believe that most of us appreciate being able to embrace our root identity. We can`t expect to be accepted into special groups created for a particular group of people if we do not qualify. I can join a Jewish church but I can not be Jewish. I can became a naturalized Japanese but I can not become Japanese. We all need to respect each others space in order to live in harmony.
Children of mixed heritage are in unique situations, and they should have options of being a part of which ever group they relate to most or not. I for one enjoy the cultural and physical differences that the people of the world have. It would be very boring any other way. That does not make me a racist either, because I respect all the people of this world.

Exactly, Tokyo OG.

A lot of people, in America the most, don't seem to realize that you can see race WITHOUT being bigoted. It's when certain characteristics are ascribed to certain groups is when you get a problem.

TOG, it's nice if you'd be okay with a whites-only charity organization, but society in general wouldn't. It's not necessarily logical, but that's just part of how our society is at the moment. Personally I say the sooner we stop splitting up into groups over perceived (not intrinsic) differences the better, but that's the world for ya.

The reverse racism arguments never truly hold water. It is often used by racist groups as a counter to measures intended to level the playing field between racial groups.

White only groups must exist as black only groups exist. But why are we only looking at exceptions? It doesn't make sense to address an issues of the magnitude on the basis of exceptions. Let's look that majority picture.

Most charity organizations are multi-ethnic groups. Most groups representing the African American interestes are also multi-racial groups. The same goes for those representing the majority white community. This is the mainstream and a much more valid example. The rare exceptions are just that... exceptions.

As for reverse racism. My proposed plan undermines any ability to claim reverse racism. By applying the same benefits to all underclass segments of society everyone who is disadvantaged can be helped regardless of race. Education, job training, assistance and other programs can raise the poor of any race and empower them to break cycles of poverty.

While I do also believe that the African American community are deserving of some compensation for the legacy of slavery. I think it is far more productive for our society, and more unifying if beneifts are packaged as inspired by the need to raise those who society has left behind in memory of the suffering and sacrifices that slavery imposed upon African Americans. And through these programs we honor the legacy and contributions of slave suffering to the development of our nation and committ to never leave any group of people behind.

Think about it. Compensation for slavery that applies to all who need the support. What better way to honor our ancestors who suffered? I think they would have wanted all people to benefit too.

And no racist can argue with this outcome as it will be for any and all who need it. Now to convince the government to do it.