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コメント(94)
Additionally, I've heard this a lot from people. I've been told from relatives, friends, and people off of the street that I'm pretty, but they're just not interested in women beyond a certain skintone.
People's preferences ultimately play into skintones, racial characteristics and stereotypes.
People's preferences ultimately play into skintones, racial characteristics and stereotypes.
西岡昌紀>
Because many Japanese guys are bloody "shy" and "closed-minded". In other words, they stare at Westerners, but do nothing about it, and make a huge fuss about them being western. And when the western girls go up and talk to them, they only focus on their race and go on about how "western" they are.
Not my words, but of many people I've spoken to.
Because many Japanese guys are bloody "shy" and "closed-minded". In other words, they stare at Westerners, but do nothing about it, and make a huge fuss about them being western. And when the western girls go up and talk to them, they only focus on their race and go on about how "western" they are.
Not my words, but of many people I've spoken to.
indie_hunk>
>Because many Japanese guys are bloody "shy" and "closed-minded".
>In other words, they stare at Westerners, but do nothing about it,
>and make a huge fuss about them being western. And when the western
>girls go up and talk to them, they only focus on their race and go
>on about how "western" they are.
>Not my words, but of many people I've spoken to.
This is stereotyping.
>Because many Japanese guys are bloody "shy" and "closed-minded".
>In other words, they stare at Westerners, but do nothing about it,
>and make a huge fuss about them being western. And when the western
>girls go up and talk to them, they only focus on their race and go
>on about how "western" they are.
>Not my words, but of many people I've spoken to.
This is stereotyping.
While I was in Japan (3 and a half years), I got very frustrated with the dating scene as a western female interested in dating... anyone... A lot of the western men were only interested in Japanese females, which is fair enough, considering there are a few of them around in Japan... but I found that Japanese men were either very shy, or they were interested but worried about the language barrier...
On a side note... if Western relates to people from the west, does that mean aussies are actually southerners? Maybe we should get more technical about all that...
On a side note... if Western relates to people from the west, does that mean aussies are actually southerners? Maybe we should get more technical about all that...
It's very rare that I come across a Japanese guy I'm interested in who is "too" shy. SOme are a little shy at first but get a few drinsk in them and it goes away quickly.
Probably depends what kind of circle of friends/social scene you're involved with but I've never really had problems getting dates or male attention here.
Now a real boyfriend, that's just as challenging in Japan as anywhere else.
Japanese small towns can be a little tough for dating too if you are ayoung because there's often not many young people there. But big cities like Osaka and Tokyo are brimming with opportunities.
Find a hobby,
hang out with people who share the same hobby,
then the problems with supposed shyness or fetishization of Westerners for the most part disappears.
Probably depends what kind of circle of friends/social scene you're involved with but I've never really had problems getting dates or male attention here.
Now a real boyfriend, that's just as challenging in Japan as anywhere else.
Japanese small towns can be a little tough for dating too if you are ayoung because there's often not many young people there. But big cities like Osaka and Tokyo are brimming with opportunities.
Find a hobby,
hang out with people who share the same hobby,
then the problems with supposed shyness or fetishization of Westerners for the most part disappears.
O/T ~ but looks like the rest of this thread is also off topic. XD
Is there any such thing as a strictly "Western Hangout" in Japan?
I'm Jewish myself, so I've run into several problems with 'dating out side of my race'.
Even White people that aren't Jewish aren't allowed to inter-marry (dating also HIGHLY discouraged) with us of the Jewish Race.
Some people find this intimidating, I suppose... knowing that my family would never approve, but I have had a Japanese boyfriend before... 2 Chinese boyfriends, and also Mexican and Jamaican boyfriends.
Out of all of these, I definitely had the most difficulty getting to know my Japanese boyfriend. He was very shy, and because I'm also VERY shy, I think the barrier went far beyond just language.
But I think dating should be about something beyond race, or preferences... even if it isn't favorably looked upon by the likes of religion, or so-called 'racial standards'.
Is there any such thing as a strictly "Western Hangout" in Japan?
I'm Jewish myself, so I've run into several problems with 'dating out side of my race'.
Even White people that aren't Jewish aren't allowed to inter-marry (dating also HIGHLY discouraged) with us of the Jewish Race.
Some people find this intimidating, I suppose... knowing that my family would never approve, but I have had a Japanese boyfriend before... 2 Chinese boyfriends, and also Mexican and Jamaican boyfriends.
Out of all of these, I definitely had the most difficulty getting to know my Japanese boyfriend. He was very shy, and because I'm also VERY shy, I think the barrier went far beyond just language.
But I think dating should be about something beyond race, or preferences... even if it isn't favorably looked upon by the likes of religion, or so-called 'racial standards'.
I think I dated with “Western” girls rather often in my youth,
though I am one of the“shy”and “close-minded”nation.
I remember I dated with one of them in Ginza, Yurakucho,
Hibiya, Ueno, Yokohama, and so on.
And I dated with another “Western”girl in Nagano-pref,
as well as in Tokyo.
I can assure there were many places for “Western”girls
to date in Japan.
though I am one of the“shy”and “close-minded”nation.
I remember I dated with one of them in Ginza, Yurakucho,
Hibiya, Ueno, Yokohama, and so on.
And I dated with another “Western”girl in Nagano-pref,
as well as in Tokyo.
I can assure there were many places for “Western”girls
to date in Japan.
Read:
"I'm quite sure there are exceptions, but generally speaking, that is what I hear from a lot of people, and I find that to be the case as well."
Cue to the bit that goes "There are exceptions".
And are you a foreign woman? Not to sound rude, but the reason why I posted this topic is because I have heard A LOT of foreign women complain about dating scene in Japan. You can ignore it as much as you want, but the truth of matter is, some people do find dating in Japan frustrating compared to other countries.
"I'm quite sure there are exceptions, but generally speaking, that is what I hear from a lot of people, and I find that to be the case as well."
Cue to the bit that goes "There are exceptions".
And are you a foreign woman? Not to sound rude, but the reason why I posted this topic is because I have heard A LOT of foreign women complain about dating scene in Japan. You can ignore it as much as you want, but the truth of matter is, some people do find dating in Japan frustrating compared to other countries.
>indie_hunk
Read what you wrote.
You titled this column “Where do Western girls go to date in Japan?”
This odd title asks WHERE.
(That's why I answered where I dated with European girls
in Japan in my youth.)
This title does not ask about Japanese men.
But you argue about the character of Japanese guys.
This is irrelevant with the title.--WHERE DO WESTERN GIRLS
GO TO DATE IN JAPAN?
You are illogical.
Read what you wrote.
You titled this column “Where do Western girls go to date in Japan?”
This odd title asks WHERE.
(That's why I answered where I dated with European girls
in Japan in my youth.)
This title does not ask about Japanese men.
But you argue about the character of Japanese guys.
This is irrelevant with the title.--WHERE DO WESTERN GIRLS
GO TO DATE IN JAPAN?
You are illogical.
dating is just as easy/difficult in japan as anywhere else in the world.
It depends on many factors.
But to actually approach someone and initiate communication, hoping to get into something romantical, there has to be "desire" on both parts.
And the aspect of "fantasy" is important in order to feel desire for someone else.
Sometimes, you just see someone in the distance, and all you have to analyse is the looks.
And people will inevitably create stereotypes based on their personal fantasies, because that's how the wheels of desire are fueled. If we don't feel desire for another person, then nothing happens.
And fantasies can be very broad. Some people fantasize about personality traits of another person, or just plain looks. People have expectations about other human beings all the time.
It's unavoidable. The question is, after the first meeting, are they able to abandon their first expectations, and just accept the natural characteristics of the other person?
It's OK to have fantasies about certain characteristics or traits. everyone has them, even if they won't admit them. The question is, how far will they go to fulfill those fantasies? Will they reject potential partners because they don't comply with their personal fantasies? Or because of social pressure?
Inevitably, social pressure is a big factor in choosing a partner.
You might call these people "weak", but maybe the way in which they were educated does not give them the necessary mental strength to break free of this pressure.
Many women get beaten up by their husbands, yet stay with them for years, withstanding abuse. Many people get lovers based on how wealthy they are, or how much social status they can get. These are manifestations of social pressure that are difficult to break free from.
When I was young, I didn't do as much as I could have done to get a relationship because I was shy. Having solved that problem, the only reason why I might refuse some offers from women is that I just don't feel the desire to have a romantic relationship with them.
I can't explain it on a rational level. Haven't you ever been in a situation where you receive an offer from someone who seems nice enough, and might even be kinda cute, but you just don't feel the desire? There's no way to explain rationally why. At least, not every time. There might be hundreds of reasons on why the desire does not exist. But people always want to know why, and sometimes lame excuses are invented.
It's impossible to have a conversation of this sort ("western" girls dating with "japanese" guys) without resorting to general comments, to some extent. The subject is too vast, and people will have difficulty talking about this, if they don't simplify things.
The difference is knowing whether they mean well when they say these comments, or not.
I think a lot of arguments here in Mixi are created by cultural misinterpretations.
Some people think a certain word is free of negative connotations, and others feel the opposite, and react badly to it. It's impossible to avoid these situations.
"western" women was probably meant in the context of the original poster.
She probably meant "where do women from my region go to dates in japan?". I don't think she meant any harm when using that term, and wasn't necessarily thinking of all non-japanese women when she said that.
It depends on many factors.
But to actually approach someone and initiate communication, hoping to get into something romantical, there has to be "desire" on both parts.
And the aspect of "fantasy" is important in order to feel desire for someone else.
Sometimes, you just see someone in the distance, and all you have to analyse is the looks.
And people will inevitably create stereotypes based on their personal fantasies, because that's how the wheels of desire are fueled. If we don't feel desire for another person, then nothing happens.
And fantasies can be very broad. Some people fantasize about personality traits of another person, or just plain looks. People have expectations about other human beings all the time.
It's unavoidable. The question is, after the first meeting, are they able to abandon their first expectations, and just accept the natural characteristics of the other person?
It's OK to have fantasies about certain characteristics or traits. everyone has them, even if they won't admit them. The question is, how far will they go to fulfill those fantasies? Will they reject potential partners because they don't comply with their personal fantasies? Or because of social pressure?
Inevitably, social pressure is a big factor in choosing a partner.
You might call these people "weak", but maybe the way in which they were educated does not give them the necessary mental strength to break free of this pressure.
Many women get beaten up by their husbands, yet stay with them for years, withstanding abuse. Many people get lovers based on how wealthy they are, or how much social status they can get. These are manifestations of social pressure that are difficult to break free from.
When I was young, I didn't do as much as I could have done to get a relationship because I was shy. Having solved that problem, the only reason why I might refuse some offers from women is that I just don't feel the desire to have a romantic relationship with them.
I can't explain it on a rational level. Haven't you ever been in a situation where you receive an offer from someone who seems nice enough, and might even be kinda cute, but you just don't feel the desire? There's no way to explain rationally why. At least, not every time. There might be hundreds of reasons on why the desire does not exist. But people always want to know why, and sometimes lame excuses are invented.
It's impossible to have a conversation of this sort ("western" girls dating with "japanese" guys) without resorting to general comments, to some extent. The subject is too vast, and people will have difficulty talking about this, if they don't simplify things.
The difference is knowing whether they mean well when they say these comments, or not.
I think a lot of arguments here in Mixi are created by cultural misinterpretations.
Some people think a certain word is free of negative connotations, and others feel the opposite, and react badly to it. It's impossible to avoid these situations.
"western" women was probably meant in the context of the original poster.
She probably meant "where do women from my region go to dates in japan?". I don't think she meant any harm when using that term, and wasn't necessarily thinking of all non-japanese women when she said that.
西岡昌紀>
Personal attacks? How mature.
YOU are the one that is being illogical. People asked me why I posted the question, and then I explained the reasoning. If you say that I am being "illogical" because of that, then I say you are just being silly. And I am not the only person talking about "Japanese guys and how they are" on the post. So are they being illogical too?
By the way, don't press the Enter key too hard.
Anyways, arguing with you is utterly waste of time, so I shall end it here.
Personal attacks? How mature.
YOU are the one that is being illogical. People asked me why I posted the question, and then I explained the reasoning. If you say that I am being "illogical" because of that, then I say you are just being silly. And I am not the only person talking about "Japanese guys and how they are" on the post. So are they being illogical too?
By the way, don't press the Enter key too hard.
Anyways, arguing with you is utterly waste of time, so I shall end it here.
I want to respond to what people say, but really you have to look at everything case by case.
I think if you go back to the original title "Where do Western girls go to date in Japan" do you mean "date" as in a place to go on dates, or "date" as in to search for someone to have a relationship with?
I don't think this world has a "Dates R Us" department. If you're not going on speed dating or go-con events really nothing has changed. You join a team, go to clubs or bars, just put yourself out there to be picked up by (or to pick up on) guys.
Yellow Fever --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOyRWuklsiQ&feature=related
I think if you go back to the original title "Where do Western girls go to date in Japan" do you mean "date" as in a place to go on dates, or "date" as in to search for someone to have a relationship with?
I don't think this world has a "Dates R Us" department. If you're not going on speed dating or go-con events really nothing has changed. You join a team, go to clubs or bars, just put yourself out there to be picked up by (or to pick up on) guys.
Yellow Fever --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOyRWuklsiQ&feature=related
Well, I'm married (to a Japanese guy), but I guarantee if you are semi-attractive and can speak Japanese fluently there is a good looking Japanese who is willing to date you. I don't understand all these dating issues???
Maybe if you're like really obese or something your choices are "slimmer", but there are a lot of デブセン .
Maybe if you're like really obese or something your choices are "slimmer", but there are a lot of デブセン .
>Tempest7
>I think if you go back to the original title "Where do Western girls
>go to date in Japan" do you mean "date" as in a place to go on dates,
> or "date" as in to search for someone to have a relationship with?
I share your puzzlement with you.
This title “Where do Western girls go to date in Japan” is
puzzling and there is discrepancy between this title and
the contents of this column.
>リラックミル
>Well, I'm married (to a Japanese guy), but I guarantee if you are
>semi-attractive and can speak Japanese fluently there is a good
>looking Japanese who is willing to date you.
I think so too.
This column is based on prejudice against Japanese.
>I think if you go back to the original title "Where do Western girls
>go to date in Japan" do you mean "date" as in a place to go on dates,
> or "date" as in to search for someone to have a relationship with?
I share your puzzlement with you.
This title “Where do Western girls go to date in Japan” is
puzzling and there is discrepancy between this title and
the contents of this column.
>リラックミル
>Well, I'm married (to a Japanese guy), but I guarantee if you are
>semi-attractive and can speak Japanese fluently there is a good
>looking Japanese who is willing to date you.
I think so too.
This column is based on prejudice against Japanese.
79>>
Why the hate?
Going by your logic...
Your comment is making "us" gaijin look bad!
And besides, what exactly did 西岡さん say that was so bad? All he's asking is for an explanation of the pretty much blatantly racist remarks against Japanese dudes in this thread. Is asking for reason such a bad thing?
Why the hate?
Going by your logic...
Your comment is making "us" gaijin look bad!
And besides, what exactly did 西岡さん say that was so bad? All he's asking is for an explanation of the pretty much blatantly racist remarks against Japanese dudes in this thread. Is asking for reason such a bad thing?
81> Not to burst your bubbles, but I am Japanese. Therefore, my comments cannot be construed as racism, especially a "blatant" one. I'm proud of my heritage and what-not.
And yes, the misuse of Enter key is an offense. Jokes aside, I could see how some people might be offended by my comments, but the reality is, I know many attractive bilingual western woman complain about the dating scene in Japan, and got curious. If people are going to find this topic offensive, I would say they are simply closed-minded and cannot see the fact how different cultures can pose difficulties in unexpected areas.
And yes, the misuse of Enter key is an offense. Jokes aside, I could see how some people might be offended by my comments, but the reality is, I know many attractive bilingual western woman complain about the dating scene in Japan, and got curious. If people are going to find this topic offensive, I would say they are simply closed-minded and cannot see the fact how different cultures can pose difficulties in unexpected areas.
I guess Japanese men think that no Western girls are interested in them. It is kind of "common sense" among Japanese dudes, so they get shy with Western chicks. Japanese guys in general may not be good at flirting with girls, but they are able to get Japanese girls at least because they are not afraid to go for Japanese girls.
I wonder what I should write about.
As this thread is titled as “Where do Western girls go
to date in Japan?”I seriously recalled where I dated
in my youth, but people here seem to be interested in
not WHERE but WITH WHOM.
Well, it is up to each person, isn't it?
http://mixi.jp/view_bbs.pl?id=32197179&comm_id=19163
(Why don't we talk about Charo?)
As this thread is titled as “Where do Western girls go
to date in Japan?”I seriously recalled where I dated
in my youth, but people here seem to be interested in
not WHERE but WITH WHOM.
Well, it is up to each person, isn't it?
http://mixi.jp/view_bbs.pl?id=32197179&comm_id=19163
(Why don't we talk about Charo?)
西岡昌紀>
Troll alert here. You've put in your 2 cents, now move on if you don't like this topic . If you don't like this topic, it's cool, but your obsession with enter key and semantics aren't. In Internet message boards, just like in real life conversation, it is common for people to digress from the topic they originally started. So people replied to this topic in the beginning by saying "Izakaya," "bars," and then started talking about why some people might find dating in Japan difficult, addressing the kernel of the issue.
リラックミル>
What is your job? I would LOVE to know.
When I was teaching English part-time, some of my students came on to me....
Troll alert here. You've put in your 2 cents, now move on if you don't like this topic . If you don't like this topic, it's cool, but your obsession with enter key and semantics aren't. In Internet message boards, just like in real life conversation, it is common for people to digress from the topic they originally started. So people replied to this topic in the beginning by saying "Izakaya," "bars," and then started talking about why some people might find dating in Japan difficult, addressing the kernel of the issue.
リラックミル>
What is your job? I would LOVE to know.
When I was teaching English part-time, some of my students came on to me....
>リラックミル
>Maybe some nerdy or unconfident men think that way, but I get hit on all> the time at my job by Japanese men. The ones interested in the West see>m more shy than those who just flirt with a girl they find attractive.
It sounds very interesting to me! Maybe, for some nerdy or unconfident men, western girls are not "real" just like TV celebrities or anime characters whom they think they can never date with.
Anyway I also agree that some guys just hit on the attractive girls in their sight... But for most Japanese men, I believe Western girls seem to difficult to seduce because of the language and culture difference.
But you seem to be very fluent in Japanese, so maybe that is why you get hit on by Japanese men all the time, or maybe you are too attractive and men cannot resist! ;)
>Maybe some nerdy or unconfident men think that way, but I get hit on all> the time at my job by Japanese men. The ones interested in the West see>m more shy than those who just flirt with a girl they find attractive.
It sounds very interesting to me! Maybe, for some nerdy or unconfident men, western girls are not "real" just like TV celebrities or anime characters whom they think they can never date with.
Anyway I also agree that some guys just hit on the attractive girls in their sight... But for most Japanese men, I believe Western girls seem to difficult to seduce because of the language and culture difference.
But you seem to be very fluent in Japanese, so maybe that is why you get hit on by Japanese men all the time, or maybe you are too attractive and men cannot resist! ;)
I think there are a few other factors that people haven't considered yet.
Some foreigners in Japan do have a really negative attitude, and whether they realize it or not, it rubs off on other people. So, even if a girl is attractive, if she's got a bad vibe, guys aren't likely to be interested in her.
Social circles. You can't expect to find a decent date so easily if you don't have a good social circle. And a lot of foreigners in Japan, male and female alike, seem to hang out in a bubble that consists either entirely of coworkers, or other gaijin/some random Japanese people who are interested in gaijin. But, they don't really hang out with people who share many similar hobbies and as a result, have difficulty making good, close Japanese friends and boyfriends and girlfriends. they're basically in a social circle of convenience rather than actually having a lot in common. I personally used to live in a small town with LOTS of gaijin, everyone knew each other, and it was always the same people (gaijin and Japanese) hanging out together, but I never felt like I had a really close relationship with any of them. I came to Tokyo alone, and within a few months, had a good social circle of new friends that I quickly developed a much closer relationship with because we had a lot more in common than language and location. So I think people who feel like they're in a rut should probably go and socialize more and try to make new friends that share something in common with them.
Some foreigners in Japan do have a really negative attitude, and whether they realize it or not, it rubs off on other people. So, even if a girl is attractive, if she's got a bad vibe, guys aren't likely to be interested in her.
Social circles. You can't expect to find a decent date so easily if you don't have a good social circle. And a lot of foreigners in Japan, male and female alike, seem to hang out in a bubble that consists either entirely of coworkers, or other gaijin/some random Japanese people who are interested in gaijin. But, they don't really hang out with people who share many similar hobbies and as a result, have difficulty making good, close Japanese friends and boyfriends and girlfriends. they're basically in a social circle of convenience rather than actually having a lot in common. I personally used to live in a small town with LOTS of gaijin, everyone knew each other, and it was always the same people (gaijin and Japanese) hanging out together, but I never felt like I had a really close relationship with any of them. I came to Tokyo alone, and within a few months, had a good social circle of new friends that I quickly developed a much closer relationship with because we had a lot more in common than language and location. So I think people who feel like they're in a rut should probably go and socialize more and try to make new friends that share something in common with them.
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