外国人です♪Foreigner♪コミュのHalf of Japanese culture is western!

Which major cultures in this world is going to say no to things like televisions, automobiles, mobile phones, computers, washing machines, etc.?

I don't think people assent to "Westernisation" so much as they want the technologies and all that goes with them. To support these technologies you need some sort of capitalist economic system. You can't have a fully subsistence economy today and share in all these technologies.

So, you accept the trappings of such a society, including the faster pace of life, and thus the impetus to eat fast and easy junk food, to have durable and easy to clean hard floors in place of tatami, to wear a business suit instead of a kimono and hakama for driving cars and sitting in offices, etc.

Some people say you are "Americanising" your country, but the Americans didn't start this, they also imported it initially. It all began in England in the 18th century as the first steps of the so-called "Industrial Revolution". It was in the 19th century that this spread to Europe and then America, and only in the 20th century that the USA came to dominate this new model of organising society.

Now it seems that all developed countries are converging to some extent - supermarkets look more the same, we drive the same cars, use the same computers, and increasingly adapt our business practices to the same patterns of operation.

As the local corner shop in your Japan or my Australia is replaced by the conglomerate supermarket, then the local products disappear in favour of the generic. Though we grow plenty of oranges in Australia, the supermarket oranges are often sourced from all round the world at the expense of the local grower, all for the sake of a greater profit margin for a company whose ownership may lie outside my country. That's the mentality of capitalistic, monopolistic economic structures.

Is all this the price we must accept and pay for technology in our lives? Or could we have technology and keep our culture, too? Who's making these decisions for us, and who holds the power to change any of it? Do we have to continue on this path to convergence of popular culture and the reduction to the lowest common denominator in global competition?

Well, all I know is one thing, don't look to governments to protect us, they are putty in the hands of multi-national corporations. If we don't want to be globalised to the lowest common denominator - where countries like Japan and Australia must compete with countries like China as if we were competing with an equal - then people will have to get smarter.

Just my thoughts.

This is an interesting subject. I believe that Japan will really never loose its culture as long as it is as formal as it is. The language is such that even the young people, if they want a job or an appartment, they must use the keigo forms of the language. It is still a "good ol` boys" run country, with males dominating major positions in business and government. It is homogenious, in that if you are not Japanese, you are an outsider, or Gaikokujin (literally: outside country person). Sure there is westernization, but this culture is so old and set that it will take hundreds of years to change.

Just my oppinion.

The point is moot really. "Westernization" is what the world is becoming across the board regardless of what culture you are thinking of. Everybody in the world is becoming "westernized" because that's the model we've set. Everyone wants fucking K-mart, stupid television shows, and all that crap. What most of us fail to see is the impact our "western civilization" has had on the world. Japan, and everybody in the world actually, is still reeling from the effects. Japan had its chances to try and keep its culture in tact, but certain very "Japanese" tendencies have forced them to adopt western stradegy to servive and eventually thrive in the world.

So here's the deal, and everybody is free to disagree with me on this, but really: watch Japanese TV for just 10 minutes a day, and fucking tell me, is this western culture? Guys running around in their underwear in beating each other up with foam rubber sticks?? (well, thats what's on right now). Look deeper into Japanese fashion sensibilities.... is putting cute kitty-chan (or whatever the latest "cute" craze is) crap all over your bags and cell phone as a HIGH SCHOOL TEENAGER Western??? Perhaps these points are always overlooked, as we expect everybody to be doing tea ceremonies or wearing YUKATA all the time when we come here, but trust me, even modern Japanese culture is culture nonetheless. All the crap we often complain about is simply normal "westernizing" and "capitalization" of the world. Soon, we will all have the ability to buy cheap crap made by countries poorer than we are at K-marts, Costcos or Targets everywhere. Woopdy fucking doo.

I tell you what though, Japan is worse than most if only because the soul of Japanese culture was lost so long ago that most young Japanese are desperate to buy up the false prophets and images that westernization promises. Pity really, Japan used to be an incredilby beautiful place. An amazing culture: what I would have done to have seen Kyoto, for instance, which was spared by the American bombers simply because of its historical prestige and beauty.... what I would have done to have seen it 50 years ago before the JAPANESE tore it all down and made it another copy of every other friggin place in this country. My god. It must of have been beautiful. But it, and the rest of the history and beauty were all chopped down for the need to industralize in the name of profit and progress.

As you can tell, I've got a lot to say on the matter. And I am a little drunk and probably overstating things a bit due to New Year celebrations with family, but please people, just try to understand that nothing you are seeing in Japan is truly unique except for the unique culture that was always there. In other words, you look for things to confirm that Japan is just a copy-cat of westernization, you will find it. But there is still a lot of beauty and intrigue there for the taking if if you just look for it. I implore you, find the things that make this country great and do your best to encourage your friends (especially Japanese friends, as they need all the encouragment they can get on this matter) to enjoy and protect as much as you can.

I totally agree that Japanese life style has become
more like that of Americans, but I believe that
Japanese mind is quite differentfrom Americans' or
any other people's. Please do not take me wrong.
I think it's great to be different. I believe diversity
makes the world interesting and charming(^^)

I think every nation has a core culture, which never
changes. Japan seems to have changed a lot over the
past few decades, but the bottom line is that a people
never change at the core level. Japanese are doing
the same thing as they did centuries ago, when Japan
was learning from Chinese, who was one of the most
developed countries at that time. Japanese was bitterly
defeated by the Tang dinasty of China at Battle of
Baekgang in 633, but they quickly made a number of
reformsto make the nation stronger by actively learning
Chinese Culture. Again in 1945, Japan was throughly
defeated by the Anglo-American Alled Forces, and with
the help of the States, Japan has strengthened the
nation by learning mainly from the US. Japanese life
style may have changed over the last 50 years, but I
don't think Japanese mind has changed in any way...
I can see that Samurai have been replaces by
Kanryo (beaurocrats), Nomin (farmers) by Sarariiman,
Kimono by Sebiro(Western-style business suits),
Chonmage by Sarariiman Katto, and so forth....but
Players and instruments have changed but the system
has never changed, and nor has the mentality of the
Japanese... I don't believe any other nation has
changed, either. I think all of us have been locked
in a variation of the same hierarchical system since
thefoundation of the world, and it appears we all have
developed skills to deal with it. Each nation has a
unique history and background so these skillsusually
vary from one nation or group to another.

I guess the other half of what I wanted to say was that the western countries are diverst themselves. Russia and other eastern european countries are considered west even though they do not beleive in democracy. The greeks and Danish are very different from each other. Compared with these diversity, the uniquness of japan is not so great. The west itself is so diverse anyway, what is the reason to say japan is not half-western?

I feel that this culture is so rooted in it's ways and old style that even though you see the influence of the west here, it is certainly not HALF western

Japan has been through westernization but I don't know if you can say half of japanese culture is western. I just think it's modernization.

To be honest, I never heard anything about Japan being "unique" until I came to japan hearing it from Japanese people. Maybe Japan seems very "unique" because the Japanese people are taught such? Actually, almost ALL countries have ppl that are taught they are special or unique in some area b/c in old times most people only knew of thier own country as thier entire world. Even the country next door, or even the next village must of been seen as a different world. I think that many asian countries (not just japan) hold on to this "uniqueness" thing becuase of thier almost homogeneous societies and because much of world history is written from the western or Eurocentric point of view (some would say, the "victors" side of the story.

you guys are still comparing apples and oranges.... how in the world can you argue with a straight face that countries A or B are more westernized or more unique than C.... there is no way to quantify it. the term "western" in itself is such a juggernaut that i think you better think twice about what that term really means (go back to my previous post above). i'm sorry, i hate to sound like a jerk here, but it worries me that anybody could be so shallow as to not recognize the things that make ANY COUNTRY, ANYWHERE unique. there is PLENTY that Japan has to offer that is truly, breath-takingly unique, but you better take off "westernized" sunglasses to get a better view.

you guys are still comparing apples and oranges.... how in the world can you argue with a straight face that countries A or B are more westernized or more unique than C.... there is no way to quantify it. the term "western" in itself is such a juggernaut that i think you better think twice about what that term really means (go back to my previous post above). i'm sorry, i hate to sound like a jerk here, but it worries me that anybody could be so shallow as to not recognize the things that make ANY COUNTRY, ANYWHERE unique. there is PLENTY that Japan has to offer that is truly, breath-takingly unique, but you better take off "westernized" sunglasses to get a better view.

Well, lets use the word patriotic and proud. I feel that most Japanese people I meet are more proudly patriotic than many other places I have been. It is almost obsessive.

Sincere apology that I used the word "unique" in careless manner. I guess it just confused the entire discussion, so just take away from the argument. Japan is one of the most westernized country in the world, just as japan was 'China-nized' hundreds years ago, or just as Turkey was westernized at the begginign of 20th century (although at less extensively). But, it is true that each country is unique itself, and putting that concept in reasoning was not well-thought.

Is there anyone has different thought? I am just curious about people think differently.

I have a few places where I feel that Japan is not westernized. If you look at the traditional forms and arts as well as the language. There are deep rooted Japanese feelings there that can not change so easily. I don`t think that the style of matsuri is duplicated in the west either. These are things that will not become westernized.

15: 茶人 san,

I perfectly agree with what you wrote. Sure japan has many non-western stuff. But my point is that japan is western half way. It is the mixture of west and east. It has got both.

What is western? Is modern western? I think evolution is the key here. It is not really westernizing as growing and being more worldly. Look at all the influences, not just the western influence. I think that growth is natural for any developing or developed nation. How can any country not become like another when there are so many influences? But it is not just western and I don`t think it is nearly that 50% or even 25%.

Looking at the peoples in Northeast Asia, we can see
that they tend to be more pro-West than any other part
of Asia. Foe example, the Siberan tribes received the
Russians in rather welcoming manners in the 17th
century. That was why there was no big conflict as
they expanded to the regiaon. Both the Koreans and
Japanese are also more pro-West than China or Southeast
Asian countries, aren't they? There is a theory that
there were some hunting-gathering peoples inhabiting
Northeast Asia, who are akin to those living in Europe.
Therefore, part of Northeast asians and europeans are
more closely realted than we think, regardless of the
differences in appearance between the two groups.
I believe that they look quite diffrent because
Northeast Asians have received massive genes from the
Chinese who migrated into the region in waves and
interbred with the indigenous population in the
past.(I didn't make this up. There's some data to back
this up.)

I think Japanese mentality is as much similar to
Europeans' as to Chinese or Southeast Asians.

My conclusion is that Japanese culture is unique, but
Japanese people are genetically related to Europeans to
some degree, which affects their mentality in some way
and makes them feel close to both Chinese and
Europeans. It's just my opinion, though.